What’s Working Now For Coaches and Course Creators With Calvin Correli

Calvin emphasizes the significance of overcoming emotions of inadequacy and having a significant influence while offering insights into the transforming path of business as a spiritual quest. He discuss about coaches and course creators in this episode.

Calvin provides ways for combining pre-recorded information with live coaching sessions and organized courses to provide a full learning experience. Calvin advocates for simplicity in systems and spirituality.

In addition, he talks on the need of continuous involvement in a community that is encouraging and adopts an iterative approach to coaching and content development, constantly refining his views based on questions posed by participants.

Here’s Where To Go Next…

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Browse more recent episodes of the LMScast podcast here or explore the entire back catalog since 2014.

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Episode Transcript

Chris Badgett: You’ve come to the right place. If you’re looking to create, launch, and scale a high value online training program, I’m your guide, Chris Badgett. I’m the co founder of Lifter LMS, the most powerful learning management system for WordPress. Stay to the end. I’ve got something special for you. Enjoy the show.

Hello and welcome back to another episode of LMS cast. I’m joined by a special guest. He’s back on the show. It’s Calvin Corelli. He’s from simplero. com, which is an online platform for delivering coaching, consulting courses and building communities with a super sweet angle of being an all in one approach.

So you don’t end up with this software Frankenstein of all these different tools. Welcome back on the show, Calvin.

Calvin Correli: Thank you, Chris. It’s great to be here. Yeah, I really appreciate you having me back. We had a conversation. What was it like three years ago or something? And I’m super excited that you’re having me back for another chat.

Chris Badgett: Yeah, I think this is going to be a good one. So Calvin and I have both been in this industry for about 10 years, basically helping people with something to share, to teach Calvin in our pre chat was describing it as like a second act. where somebody figures something out and they want to then take that knowledge and skills and experience and package it up and create a bigger impact and build a business around that with Simplero.

Let’s start there, Calvin. Tell us more about the this kind of perfect fit customer for Simplero and, really just this movement of people that. Maybe a little later in life, decide, you know what? I want to give back to those who are further back on the journey.

Calvin Correli: Yeah. So I’m inspired by Joseph Campbell’s story of the, hero’s journey, like the arc that, basically all myths from throughout history follow the same arc.

It was what inspired George Lucas to write star Wars based on the hero’s journey. And is this idea that You’re living your life. And then something happens that, that makes life as it used to be untenable. It doesn’t work anymore. Like you’re, like overweight. And I like your doctor says, you’re going to get a heart attack if you don’t do this, or you’re going to get diabetes or whatever it is, like something, something has to change, right?

Back against the wall. You need to figure out how to make some money. You may figure out how to make the money. And so we go on this journey. We, first refused to call everybody, refused to call though. Like I want to change, Oh God, then I don’t want it. And then we find a mentor and some helpers and there’s going to be some enemies and some fights, and then we go to the innermost cave of.

Battling our own demons and all that stuff. We come out, there’s more struggles and fights and more help. And then we return to where we came from. But now we have what he calls the elixir. We have the fountain of life. We have this like magic potion that we can use to help others because we figured out how to combat pre diabetes or.

Or being overweight or whatever it was, and we solved it for ourselves. And now we’re in a position where we can be the mentor to the next person. And I find, that most of the people that we work with are people of that sort. Now they have the elixir and they’re like, I got to share this thing.

Everybody in the world needs this. This is about most amazing thing ever. And then they’re like, why aren’t people just beating down my door to want this thing? And that’s when they realized. Oh crap, I need to go on another hero’s journey complete with another refusal of the call and another mentor and helpers and, enemies and opposers and going to the dark night of the soul and the innermost cave and all of that stuff to go to figure out how to actually get this to other people.

And that’s where we come in. We come in, we’re at that point where we help them on the second hero’s journey. They might already, have tried some things, right? They might have tried gluing together, like you said, nine different software platforms, email marketing and website and a shopping card and video hosting and membership site and community and affiliate tracking and surveys and, schedulers and funnel builders and like all of the things.

And they’re like, Oh

Chris Badgett: God.

Calvin Correli: complicated. So we help them on that journey on the technical side of things. And also on the, like the inner game thing, because it’s like 80, 90% it’s a, like the strategies and tactics and all that stuff is very important, but that’s. The least of it. It’s all about the mindset, the beliefs, the believing yourself, believing that you’re worthy of having a business of having a following, daring to be visible in the world, like all of those are all the things that people everybody, battles and myself included.

And so that’s why we do the software and we do the coaching for people.

Chris Badgett: Awesome. Tell me more about the coaching side, as a software company with Simplero, how do you deliver the coaching? Is it part of the package? Is it like a value add, Is it an upsell? And then what does it actually look like?

Calvin Correli: It’s a separate program. And it’s not only for people who are using the software. It’s also for people who are not using the software though, like it’s. It’s most of the people are come from the software. Cause that’s the, majority of how we’ve marketed so far, but it’s really for people outside of some players as well.

And the, idea behind it is very simple. Being an entrepreneur is a spiritual journey. Every, every problem in business is a personal problem that happens to show up in business. And every personal problem is ultimately a spiritual problem. Like it’s, about who we are being in the world. Who what’s the truth about our nature?

And the reason I say spiritual problem is because What happens is that we all have this feeling deep inside in our personality that says I’m not enough. I’m not, I’m inadequate. Someone somehow, right? It’s whether it’s I’m not rich enough or successful enough or famous enough or skinny enough or fat enough or sexy enough or whatever it is, it’s I’m not enough.

And so we try to go into Personal development, teach me how to work out, teach me how to lose weight, teach me how to build a business, all those things, which is great. It’s very valuable, but we reach a point where we realize it’s never going to fill that void of feeling not enough because that lives at the personality level.

And that’s why when we go to the spiritual level, that’s where we can actually come to terms with the fact that we are already enough at a spiritual level and we’ll never feel enough at a personality level. And then we can operate from that energy. So, that’s the work. Like for me, it’s all about making it simple and it’s about bringing in this, like it’s the simple systems and then it’s the spirituality and it’s bringing the two together to actually get where we want to go.

And the coaching. So it’s, like I said, it’s an add on to, is an additional, like it’s a separate program, if you will. And and the format is. What I see as the most effective format in the market right now. And I am curious to hear what you see out there, but it is, we do a weekly group coaching call.

It’s 90 minutes where I present a framework upfront, 15, 20 minutes or something. Sometimes it takes a little bit longer, but I present a framework and then the rest of the time is open Q and a either about that framework or really about anything that people have. And so that 90 minutes is where we meet every week.

Same time every week. That’s where I get to meet people. They get to meet me and they get to meet each other. So by showing up vulnerably with a question on that call, other people on the call, see them, everybody’s cameras on. And then the recording lives in the community site portal forever.

And so over time we build up this catalog of, knowledge, right? Both the models and all the Q and A’s. And then we have a discussion forum online and. Alongside those recordings. And because people meet each other on the calls, now the community works a lot better. So is that like content together, the group calls with the community and with some content, we have some, pieces that are pre recorded in addition to the coaching calls, put all that together, that format works really well because people can support each other.

In the community get a lot of value they can meet you they can get direct answers to those questions and It’s because they can see each other and they get all the models and frameworks And it’s very efficient for you as the coach because you show up for 90 minutes a week and then maybe a few hours Throughout the week, where you engage with the community and answer some questions, etc And I have a person On my team that manages the whole program.

So I just essentially just show up for 90 minutes a week.

Chris Badgett: Wow. That’s awesome. I would agree with you just in my experience and what I’m seeing with users that mix of content, whether that’s courses or live coaching and, community and actual like real conversational coaching is that’s where the magic happens.

Yeah. The question I have for you. I usually don’t ask two questions at once as a podcaster, but they’re related. So I’ll ask them together one. If you’ve been doing it for a while. Don’t you sometimes get to the point where your body of work has, is covered the hero’s journey or all the stages and problems.

So that’s one. And then the other one just inverse to that is I’m sure you’ve found a few areas or specific models or problem areas that are red, hot, and very popular. I’m curious what those are.

Calvin Correli: Yeah. So to answer the first I haven’t gotten there yet. And I’ve also gone back to certain topics to give a fresh take on it, a fresh perspective based on what I’ve learned in the meantime or just to sharpen it with people.

So I think that’s Fine too. The what’s great about it too, is that the questions that people ask, give me inspiration for what else to cover. And so I will, if there’s like, all right, here’s something that I see a lot of people struggling with. I actually don’t have the answer.

Let me go out and research the answer and find the answer from some of the smartest people in the world that I happen to know. And then I bring them. Or, just from books or whatever research I do. And then I bring it to them and I’ll be like, Hey, this is something that I haven’t yet implemented, or I’m in the process of implementing.

So I don’t know, I can’t tell you about, I am not talking about this from my personal experience of what I’ve done. I’m saying, this is what I’ve gathered. Here’s where I’ve gathered it. Here’s why I believe that’s one of the best answers out there right now. Because of these people or what I’ve seen or heard or, this place in that place.

So I love that because it like, I, if I try to sit down and create content and come up with stuff like in a vacuum by myself, it never, ever works. It never works. What works is always. Meet people, answer their questions, listen to their questions, see where they’re at, figure out what they need, and then deliver that either in the moment, or I’ll give the best answer I have in the moment.

Then I’ll make a note and go back and research and go deeper next time. And your second question was, what are the hot topics right now?

Chris Badgett: Yeah. Favorite greatest hits.

Calvin Correli: So the. The model, this is something that, that I’m curious what you’re doing, but for, lead generation and conversion, right? Every business has three, three main parts.

You have the, you need to generate leads. People are interested, right? If you have a hot dog stand, it’s like the people who walk by or whatever, the potential prospect, right? Then you need to engage them in a conversation where you can have a chance of converting them. So sales So that’s when they’re step up and they’re interested.

I, you try to sell them a hot dog and maybe a soda as well. And should you want a pretzel with your hot dog or whatever upsells, whatever you have. And then delivery. So where you actually deliver the hot dog. Give them the hot dog. And then they hopefully eat and enjoy it. And it reminds me of it’s crazy.

I just, a book that I’ve read recently, which is on unreasonable hospitality. It’s freaking incredible. If you’ve ever read it we can double pick on that later. There’s a great hot dog story in there. Anyway, so. lead leads, conversions or sales and fulfillment leads tends to be the thing that everybody wants more of.

How do you get more leads or, and conversion to how do you convert those leads? But generally people want more leads, right? That’s the number one thing. And something that I’ve been struggling a lot with, like, how do you get good leads? You can do It’s basically like people talk about organic partner and paid.

Yeah. So organic is you put like SEO and SEO SEO is optimization, but SEO which I personally have always found excruciatingly boring, but. I know it works really well for some people, but then when you have chat dbt and Gemini and are we going to see a move away from search results and all that stuff.

So questions on that. And then there’s like posting organic content, which was great, like five, six years ago. And most of these platforms, mostly now it’s really hard. Yeah. Like real TikTok shorts are where you get the chances of distribution, but the games has gotten like a lot harder, So organic is difficult.

Partner can definitely work. Like that’s affiliate programs, referral programs of different kinds, partner programs. Ambassador programs. It’s definitely one of the things that have worked well for us, but we found it so far, it’s been tricky for us to really scale it. Like it does, it works well, but we don’t have a lot of levers to pull on it that we’ve been able to build, like acquiring new people or getting existing new partners or getting existing partners to promote more.

Hasn’t really done move the needle for us. Then there’s paid running ads. That is getting harder and harder as well. Like four years ago during, the pandemic. Everybody flocked to their computers and as we’re working on gangbusters, if it’s always been a game of that. You have to know what to do and how to do it.

You have to be a little bit smart, but like they generally worked really well. And then it’s just getting more and more expensive and more and more hard. Even back the whole reason that ClickFunnels exists is because of funnels, which is because like you couldn’t, you can no longer make the math work if you just ran ads to an offer.

And that was it. You need upsells in order to pay for the traffic in order to make the math work. And and, even with the most, the deepest, most advanced, most clever funnels, like it’s harder and harder. To make ads work. Russell did a podcast. Russell Bronson from ClickFunnels did a podcast end of December where he was like, I don’t know what to do.

I’m at Whitson. Like all our funnels are just not working as well anymore. And he was going to go hard on organic content as, the way to the, to To do it. Because if if you look at Alex, I’m always like what he’s done has been really, successful. It’s a lot of work. It’s a lot of effort.

You have to be really good at it, but it really works when you do it. So my conclusion is like a long answer to say my conclusion is that the best way to get attention these days. In general, and for me specifically is podcasts, which is why I’m here. So by going on podcasts, the right podcasts, of course but by going on podcasts, I get a chance to be in front of new people, new audience.

And those people that are attracted to like it, they end up spending like 45 minutes with me, which is fucking awesome versus an ad where they, or exactly where it’s five, 45 seconds or 60 seconds or whatever it is. Now they’re spending a lot of time with me. And then I’m going to invite people to then follow me on Instagram at Calvin Corelli on Instagram, go follow me there.

And then DM me if you DM me the words 10 K I’ll send you my super simple blueprint for how you can scale to 10 K a month as a coach, like the simplest possible. Path that I’ve come up with. So that’s my CTA. So now I’m getting people on Instagram, getting a DM and then on the DMS, I am going to spoiler alert.

I am going to chat with you and see if you’re fit to work with me either on some players as a client on some layer, or as a client on my co in my coaching programs and player Academy. And that’s. I found so far is the model that appeals the most to me. I’m not paying for ads. I’m actually getting to spend like 45 minutes an hour with someone that I like and that I care about.

And I talk about stuff that I care about for people who are interested enough to spend the time to, to listen to it. So that to me is the hot topic right now is like that combination of podcasts or like stages in general. So being can be in a physical stage, can be a summit, it can be whatever, but you’re on someone else’s stage talking now, and then you get people onto your social media.

I like Instagram a great chat DM platform. YouTube doesn’t have that. Facebook does. LinkedIn has a chat. So I like where we can actually. Converse with people. Cause that’s the, transaction happens in conversation, that conversion happens in conversation. Not it’s harder and harder to get like a landing page to work.

And so with this model, you don’t need funnels. You don’t need landing pages, you don’t need, any of that stuff. You can just over chat and roll people directly into your programs at 5k, 10 K, 20 K, 30 K. Like it’s there’s really no. Like you can enroll people into very high ticket programs over chat without a call without nothing else.

So that works really remarkably well. And so it’s that combination podcast to get new eyeballs, Instagram, or whatever your preferred social is to, nurture and convert those people. And that becomes a funnel, right? That becomes the funnel. That’s your podcast is your top of funnel. And then Instagram becomes your middle of funnel and your bottom of funnel.

So you don’t need. Yeah, no complicated software and tech and all that stuff.

Chris Badgett: I love that. And podcast too, gives you a lot of brand awareness. That’s not tracked. Like you don’t always know, but yeah, that’s still matters.

Calvin Correli: A hundred percent. It’s what’s in people’s heads. I remember a conversation I had with Gary Vaynerchuk years ago, where it was like, everybody else is like. So obsessed with the emails and the followers and they want to have all the, you’re like, I don’t care about that.

I just want to have that position in your mind, I want to have the, shelf space in your mind. So you’re going to look me up on Instagram whatever. Cause I like, I’m already in you and that’s that’s so powerful when you do that well.

Chris Badgett: Yeah. And you mentioned the podcast 45 minutes, I’ve heard it called portable content of it.

I’ve been podcasting for 10 years. I started my podcast at the same time as Tim Ferriss. I’m just a lot less known, but the whole thing with portable content is you’re only competing with three things. Audio books and music and podcasts. Other podcasts. And

Calvin Correli: you also portable as in people listen to it while they’re walking or driving or whatnot, doing the

Chris Badgett: dishes, whatever.

And, you have that long time, like po at least probably the small podcast is like 12 minutes. A long one’s three hours. Yeah. So you, have a lot of attention without as much distraction as like on a screen per se. Yeah. So that’s for course creators and coaches in particular. I think podcasting is absolutely great because not only can you sharpen your expertise.

By interacting with other leaders in your field and representing the best interests of your client.

Calvin Correli: Yeah.

Chris Badgett: But you’re building that partnership relationship at the same time, where cross promotion, joint ventures or whatever can happen. Exactly. And that’s

Calvin Correli: a huge thing too. I’m glad you brought that up.

Cause yeah, like you and I being, on this chat together, like now we’re refreshing a relationship that has been dormant for a few years. And now Oh yeah. Chris is top of mind. Calvin’s top of mind. So. it’s really that opportunity for, relationship building is awesome.

And so my strategy is I have my own podcast as well. I don’t use that for new, for Legion, right? Because that’s not going to happen like that. If people are not going to I might, if I get really good at SEO, whatever, like people might search the park, Apple podcast directory and find my podcast, but probably not.

That’s more once they heard about me. On your show on LFTR LMS what, is the podcast called? I forgot

Chris Badgett: it’s LMS cast

Calvin Correli: on LMS cast. Once they found me, once they hear about me on LMS cast, they’re going to follow me on Instagram and then they might go try to look me up on YouTube or just podcast, and then they’re going to find my podcast and get spent, spend more time with me.

But my, that’s not even like the primary thing for my podcast is, number one, building relationships. So getting people on my podcast that I want to build a relationship with, that could be for potential referral partners, or it could be potential clients that I want to get in front of. And secondarily for content.

So we’ll take the content off of the. My podcast as well as this podcast, and then put that into what I call my content machine that then finds snackable bits that we can post as TikTok, YouTube shorts or reels, and also longer, like YouTube clips as well. And so those are the two purposes of my own podcast fulfills, but it’s not a lead gen tool.

Chris Badgett: That’s awesome. Yeah. I, in my opinion, podcast is like the super, platform that can go a lot of places and do cross functional things. Totally. For the course creators and coaches out there, we’ll go ahead. You had another

Calvin Correli: thought. It’s just like when I started podcasting and I haven’t been super active, but I’m getting back into it now.

But when I started, I was really worried about but, I don’t have much traffic. It’s been, I think I’ve had one person ever that I asked to be on my podcast that were, was interested in that number. People don’t give a crap about how many downloads you have on your podcast. Generally, they’re just like, they want, they’re excited to chat with you and emailing people and saying, Hey, will you be on my podcast?

It’s such a better ask than, Hey, will you be a referral partner for me? Or do you want to like, can I sell you my software or my coaching program or my thing? My course, it’s a much better ask to say, Hey, do you want to be on a podcast? And then, Oh, by the way, now we can have a conversation.

Chris Badgett: I love that for, me.

Course creators and coaches who I know this is a hot button issue in our industry. So I wanted to ask your take on it, who have, who are wanting to do marketing. They’re getting that imposter syndrome of getting out on the stage, taking on the role of the mentor in, as in the hero’s journey framework for others.

And they’re like, who am I to be Gandalf or Obi Wan Kenobi or whatever that comes up. And then also just literally getting into creating information products and making video content videos and YouTube channels and take talks and all this, especially from your perspective as a spiritual teacher, how does one get moving and get past that imposter syndrome

Calvin Correli: by making it about them, not you.

When you’re like, Oh, I, who am I to, and I don’t have, and what it like, that’s you making it all about you. The more you can make it about serving other people that, that just totally goes away. Cause it’s not about you. It’s about them. So put your focus there. It’s actually my, my my first book is show up and serve for that reason, right?

Show up and serve, just show up and serve and not. Don’t be so focused on yourself. Focused on the difference that you can make for other people. It’s not even about so a hot topic along those lines are, you allowed to coach people on stuff that you haven’t yourself you haven’t.

Fully mastered yourself. And I think it’s fair. And I think like Gary Vaynerchuk likes to harp in on 22 year old life coaches. Dude, you haven’t fucking lived life. Get out of here. My take is that, that if you’re. If you’re on the path and you’re doing the work and you’re figuring stuff out, like you can even if you’re not, honestly, if you have the skills to actually help other people achieve their results, then go do it.

Just be honest about where you’re at. Forget the, like the fake like. all all those like fake private jet photos and, like fancy cars and all that bullshit. Forget all of that. It’s about you being just as, real with people as possible. One of my friends is Gay Hendricks is author of, the big leap and, many other books and been working on relationship, et cetera.

But he coached Michael Dell at Dell computers, for example, it’s not like he’s built a billion dollar. Tech company, right? It doesn’t have to, in order to successfully coach Michael Dell, because he knows how the mind works and knows to get Michael Dell to the, like, wherever Mike needs to go. I don’t know the details of their conversation.

I just know that they work together. So it’s not that you have to have the exact results. Is that you have what it takes to actually help people move forward in a genuine way. I think the trick is to, when we make it about ourselves Oh because I, like you’re, like, I need you to, for me to feel good, like about myself, like you become a proof that I’m like the bad ass, the bad guy the baller or something, right?

Like that whole like ego place, that’s where it gets a little bit tricky. You’re coming from a place of genuinely wanting to serve people, then go fricking serve those people. Like they, they need you. The other piece of that is like the further along you are, the harder it can sometimes be to remember what it felt like to be where you were like 10 years ago or something.

So when you’re closer to where your, clients are, you might actually be able to help them better.

Chris Badgett: I love that. You just gave me a new insight as a deep Joseph Campbell, study or myself, which is that the mentor like Gandalf, he didn’t get the ring. He helped Frodo get the ring. Morpheus didn’t stop the matrix.

He hadn’t done it, but he was a great mentor and guide for Neo to figure it out and find a way. The mentor is not necessarily a God. They’re just they just know how to bring the best out of people. That’s, a cool insight. Let’s talk about masterminds. I know that’s some of your users that’s in Plero or wanting to build masterminds as because they’d love community, but it can also be a powerful product that it can be life changing and really send a ripple of impact out into the world.

But how does one construct one of those?

Calvin Correli: Yeah, I mean masterminds is an interesting phenomenon, right? Cause it’s it feels so originally the idea came from Napoleon Hill. He writes about it in law of success. He writes about it in, in think and grow rich law of success. By the way, I only heard about fairly recently, like a couple of years ago and it’s Amazing.

You haven’t, if you read thing and grow rich, but you haven’t read law of success, I highly recommend getting into law of success is just incredible. Lays it out like very clearly. But so the idea of the mastermind is that you grab, gather a handful of people or a dozen people, whatever it is that have a shared outcome.

And we’re, working together towards that goal in our industry. Mastermind has been, morphed into this idea, Concept where it’s just like, we meet like three, four times a year maybe. And then there’s some coaching and then there’s some or not some coaching, really more, more content.

There’s some talks and then there’s some you can chat around the tables or in the breaks or whatnot. And then there’s an online component where you have the recordings from the live events, and then you’ve got a community where people can use each other. I have found that I think, honestly, that model maybe has peaked.

Because I think what people want and need are is like more, of the coaching, more of the relationship building. I’ve, what I’ve seen is that usually the online component isn’t working as well. For people in those programs, as in some other programs, I don’t know what you’ve seen. But I, really like that coaching format where someone is actually taking lead and saying, Hey, I’m on, I’m coaching and there’s a community where people can, use each other.

But I have a point of view. I have frameworks. I have a a direction here that I’m coaching people on because I think people come to you a lot because they want something that you have. They want to be like you in some way, and that’s what attracts people. And then you can help people with that.

But then. Really the bait and switches that you that a good coach will help people be themselves like they’re attracted to you because there’s some part of themselves that they have disowned that they’re seeing in you and they want some of that, which is awesome as you can help them reclaim that piece and then really.

Put the spotlight on them to be who they are, not be like you.

Chris Badgett: In my experience, I’ve I’m a huge fan of masterminding and I’m in some that have been going for four years meeting regularly and the best ones. They really, it’s not part of a product. It’s just people at a very similar spot with very similar goals, trying to do similar things, get together.

It’s outside of a product that doesn’t cost anything, It’s just a group of people. To me, that’s been.

Calvin Correli: Yeah.

Chris Badgett: The most sustainable and successful. I think when you try to productize that,

Calvin Correli: yeah,

Chris Badgett: I think you’re better off, like you’re saying, doing the courses and the coaching and then encouraging your members to form masterminds on their own, and that might, that can actually benefit your business by being a part of that connection and all that.

But it. It is tricky to turn it into a product that to have the long term benefits of a mastermind.

Calvin Correli: Yeah. The simple answer to your question is once you have five people, you have a group.

Chris Badgett: Yeah.

Calvin Correli: So, if you want to start a group, like a mastermind or group coaching program or whatever it is, once you have five people, you have something and then it’s just building from there and getting, success with those early people and making sure that they love it.

And then they refer their, friends to it because it’s so great. And then you build on that.

Chris Badgett: Yeah. Let’s talk more broadly about the industry. What do you see in these past three years? Say if we go back to the early days of like online courses and internet marketing and like 2, 000 courses that were just videos with a bunch of bonuses.

Where are we at today? In terms of a better stack or this person called for the second act to do something, there’s all this overwhelm that comes with like tools and like what you’re actually offering. What would you advise that person to simplify and get focused and give them a frame to step into?

Calvin Correli: Yeah, I think that the whole. Like the concept of the value ladder, like you have something cheap and then something a little bit more expensive, a little more expensive, like that, that, like all those steps on that ladder is a little like outdated. We don’t need that the same way anymore. I think the people who come to you, like the leads are hottest when they come right in the door.

I think we’ve all been there where we, were searching something over the weekend and we looked at, and then we like reached out to someone on Instagram and got in the DMs or whatever the process was. And then. Like we didn’t hear back. And then by the time like Monday, Tuesday rolls around and we got a response, we couldn’t remember what was it?

Why was I like, really so keen on that? And then I forget so there’s like a halftime half life of, leads. And I think that the danger is like if you give people something like cheap and need to walk them up the value ladder, like the best clients are just going to go find someone else who will get them like what they really need at the point that they’re willing to pay, which is I hire probably and, give their money to that person.

So I think it’s more, what I’m seeing is like the, all the free social media content, marketing stuff, and the quality there keeps getting up, right? The bar keeps being raised for the quality of content that you need to put out there to be really heard and seen if you want to build a big brand and then So the free stuff and then a low ticket subscription, like for us, it’s the simpler or the software, but you’d also be like a low ticket 50, a hundred dollars, 150, maybe 200 a month community paid community.

And then a high ticket thing after that. So that could be more of like the eight, 10 K a year kind of thing. And then, or 15, 20 or something in that range, even 30, 60, and then you can go super high for Though one on one VIP experience, right? I’ve seen people charge two, 300, 000 for one on one coaching and a year kind of thing.

But so there’s still a value ladder of sorts, but it’s more like your cheap membership is really just a way to get to like your new lead nurture that you get paid for and what you want to do. And it’s helps you offset some of your. Advertising costs. There’s always going to be costs associated even with while you’re doing his podcast and still cost you money to do your time and all that stuff.

So it helps offset some of that. And then and, weed out the prospects that are not interested enough to pay you, like it could be as little as 10 bucks a month, right? Like it can be really low ticket, but it’s enough to get, have some skin in the game and say, Hey, these people are interested and now you can.

You can ascend people into your quote unquote real programs and then have that eight, 10, 15 K annual program as your main bread and butter business.

Chris Badgett: If you could wait, wave a magic wand, would you advise somebody to build, say, a lower cost recurring community first before building the high ticket program or opposite?

Opposite. Yeah.

Calvin Correli: Build the like eight, 10, 15 K a year program first, because that’s where you’re going to see. The most traction, the most value, you’re going to make the most money from doing that. And you’re going to prove that model works. And then you descend from that into, a cheaper membership later, but you, should be able to get just at least a handful of people in there.

without too much effort. And then, and you can lower the price on that and you can do it for free and say, Hey, I just need some case studies. The only, I’ll do it. It’s normally 10, 000 or 5, 000 or whatever it is, but I’ll do it for you for free. If you will promise that if you like it, offer me a testimonial and and, refer to her friends or something like that.

Because we want, we need to get started. We need some case studies. We need to show that we actually can deliver results for people. And so if you don’t have that, you can do that to get started.

Chris Badgett: Awesome. I’m sure you see this too. So I want to get your take is education, entrepreneur person, but also a spiritual person.

Sometimes there’s really talented people out there that have a lot of interest. Maybe they got really paid really well at their job doing X, Y, Z, but they hate it, but they’re actually really into like yoga and alternative healing or, and like some kind of fitness program. And they’re just, they can’t pick a topic or an avatar.

And they’re just like, they’re really excited about entrepreneurship and marketing and they want to do this thing. But their, topic and avatar selection is just a mess. What do they do?

Calvin Correli: Pick one for sure. Pick one and pick one that you know, and right? Someone that you would enjoy working with, whatever that avatar is that you.

That you, have to really love the clients that you work with. You have to love working with them. So that’s a given. And then if that still leaves multiple options, then I would pick the ones that are, have the most money to pay you or for whom, like for whom, what you can offer for them is.

Is value valuable to the extent that they want to pay a good money for it, that they have the money to pay you for it, and that you can close, you can find them, you can target them and you can enroll them fairly easily. So those are the factors, right? You want to be like high average price point fast time to close when people to easily identify and target those people.

And then really enjoy working with them.

Chris Badgett: Solid advice. And just to jump on the other side of from leads over sales to fulfillment, what is unreasonable hospitality? You peaked my interest earlier, so I got to find out what this

Calvin Correli: is. So it’s a book about 11 Madison park, which is a restaurant like right up there on, on the upper East.

That was the number one restaurant in the world for many years. And the book describes what they did to just. Over deliver on people’s expectations as patrons of this restaurant. And what I love about it, like it’s something that we at Simplero, we over invest in customer success.

And if something, if you look at our reviews online, almost all of them mentioned our customer support, our customer service, just cause we, really care and that just comes from me. Cause I just love great customer service. I hate receiving terrible customer service experience. I hate being like talked down to, or not heard properly. And there’s so much garbage customer service out there. So something that we really invest in. And so when I read that book, I was like, it was one of those things where three people were recommending that book within two days. It was like, okay, she’d probably read it.

I read it. And then now I’m getting the whole team to read it. Cause we’re already good at this. And I want to like just double, triple down on that. And so one of the examples in there. Is that the they would be so attentive to their guests. One of the waiters was overhearing some two couples that were visiting the city and they’d eaten at all the top restaurants in the city and they just had a great time and this is not, they didn’t share this with the waiter.

They just, the waiter happened to hear this and they’re like, their only regret was that they didn’t actually. Get to visit a New York city hot dog stand, like the total opposite end of the spectrum from all these gourmet restaurants. But they were just like, they just wanted to have that experience. And so the waiter hears it.

Runs out the door to the hot dog cart on the corner buys a New York hot dog for them brings it to the kitchen and has the chef prepare it. So he chops this hot dog into four pieces, puts them on separate plates and then does some like chef magic, garnishing, whatever. And then they serve that as like an extra surprise dish to the group and they’re just ecstatic over the moon.

And that level of just attention to people, to care, to just like running with it and like the chef in the story was like, what the fuck are you talking about? He’s no, Trust me. Like we’re doing this. And then they went through with it. I just love that. It was like a couple of other examples.

There was a when, people come show up at the restaurant, they’re Ready for their, for to T they will have looked up everybody who reserved a table, they’ll have looked them up on Google. If you have the photo on the internet somewhere, they’re going to find that photo. So when you step in the door, they greet you by name, right?

Half an hour, 45 minutes before your reservation comes up, they review those photos. So they’re ready for you by the time you come in the door. And as you’re entering, someone is signaling to. The, host, whether your table is ready or not. And so they don’t need to look at the computer. They can just say, Hey, like here, they can just take you to the bar to wait or take you directly to the table.

They don’t need like these, be with you the whole time when you’re at the table and they’re asking you, do you want still sparkling or tap water. They’re going to, the waiter that asks you is going to signal some hand signs behind his back. And then someone else comes in instantly, like just gives you the right water.

So it’s it’s just thinking things through like little details like that. That’s just. For me, I just for me, I love that. I love that stuff.

Chris Badgett: Wow. That’s amazing. It’s, and I just want to confirm, it’s definitely part of your brand. Like that care and that empathy and that great support. I have a friend near me.

Who’s a cook and a chef. He’s actually. Use some Plero and I remember him talking about your just the, vibe and the support and the experience of the company. And I’ve just noted that’s just no implanted in my brain with the brand of some players, like these guys go above and beyond and support and actually really care about their customers.

And the fact that you have the the coaching as well, it’s just an indication. Like we’re just, we’re not just trying to sell you software. We want you to be successful and remove blockages and stuff like that.

Calvin Correli: Yeah. And doing the coaching for me has been just remarkable. Like I see coaching. As a force multiplier, I get to be with my audience every week, experience exactly what they’re struggling with so that I can take I just ingrains my people, my avatar into my brain every single week.

And it aligns me with the people that I’m serving in such a deep way. It’s been really helpful for me, like really profound to do that. And it’s crazy because I was like for many years, I was so busy doing the software and so busy feeling like I was not worthy and imposter and all of the stuff that we all struggle with that I didn’t do the coaching.

And it was actually one of my friends that, that. Whom sidebar I met at a food truck in Washington Square Park over there some years ago, right at the beginning of COVID. He was the one that, that got me to do a coaching program. I’m so grateful because it’s been, yeah, game changer for me and for the company and for our people.

Chris Badgett: That’s awesome. And it ties back into your last point, which was that. If you’re having trouble selecting a topic or an avatar or a niche, who do you want to spend time with? Because if you’re going to be really good, you’re going to be spending a lot of time with these people and you got to like them and get them and want to keep understanding and going deeper.

Calvin Correli: Yeah. And an added bonus for, me too, has been with this coaching program, I’m doing exactly what my clients are doing. I’m doing the same thing using the same software. Guess where Simplero Academy runs? Of course it runs in Simplero. Everything runs in Simplero. And so that’s why too, I like doing it externally as well.

So we’re not just doing, working with Simplero client, Simplero members, but also with people who are not on Simplero yet is really helpful because that. Is me doing the things that I like that my clients would be doing.

Chris Badgett: That’s awesome. Calvin, thanks for coming back on the show. I really appreciate it.

He’s a simplero. com. He also has a personal website at calvincarelli. com. Is there any other way you mentioned mentioned again, the The, Instagram DM thing.

Calvin Correli: So follow me, go follow me on Instagram at Calvin Corelli, C A L V I N C O R E L I two R’s one L very confusing. Calvin Corelli at Instagram and then DM me the there’s 10 K and say that you came from, LMS cast the podcast.

Then I’ll, know that this is where you heard. You discovered me and then I’ll send you over the link to the like the video where I break down how to get to 10, 000 a month as a coach. And and then, yeah, see how, if we can support you either on some Blair or in similar Academy or just some other way.

Chris Badgett: Awesome, Calvin. Thanks for coming back on the show. We’ll have to do this again sometime.

Calvin Correli: All right. Appreciate it, Chris. Thank you.

Chris Badgett: And that’s a wrap for this episode of LMS cast. Did you enjoy that episode? Tell your friends and be sure to subscribe so you don’t miss the next episode. And I’ve got a gift for you over at LifterLMS. com forward slash gift. Go to LifterLMS. com forward slash gift.

Keep learning, keep taking action, and I’ll see you in the next episode.